Hobbies and Friendship: Preparing (early!) for the Empty Nest and Retirement: Dara Collins and Donna Kassman

"Many friends are entering the empty nest phase of their lives and some are really dreading it. Celebrities like Brooke Shields share on social media how they aren't ready. Planning ahead by embracing new hobbies and friendships can help change the focus during this major life shift." 

Those words are from guests Dara Collins and Donna Kassman, queens of mahjong and canasta. Maybe a game is not your thing, that's okay. There is a new (or old!) passion out there waiting for you. I started playing tennis again when I was 44. I'm 47 now and had not played since I was 15. It's been an immense joy and a surprising expansion of my social life too.

Hobbies are an investment in your future retirement and empty nest social life. And socializing at all ages is important for combating loneliness and keeping your brain active. Did you love a sport or activity as a kid, but you've neglected that hobby (or any non-work, non-family passion) as an adult? This episode is for you!

We have two messages today about hobbies and friendship: 

#1. Get involved in hobbies when you're still in a full and busy stage of life. You're planting seeds for later!

#2. But it's never too late to get involved in a new hobby.


Meet Dara Collins and Donna Kassman

Dara and Donna are two friends and former attorneys in South Florida who met when their now 23-year-olds were in Mommy and Me classes. In 2019, they created Mahjong Dice™ and began their small business with a beautiful roll on ModernMahjong.com. They expanded into many other mahjong and canasta items, including books on both subjects, and links and opportunities to find teachers and join tournaments. They also organize tournaments and teach throughout the year. Find Modern Mahjong on Instagram, on their Facebook page, and through their Mahjong Community Facebook group of over 47,000 people. 

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Dara: And Nina, I love that you did tennis in honor of your dad. It doesn't have to be any of the hobbies we're talking about. When Donna and I first met we set up a chess and scrabble group for the kids. I did not know anything more than how the chess pieces worked, but they were in second grade and they knew chess.

So all we had to do was supply the sets and host the meeting. And we were having a tournament with another school. And I said to the gentleman, do you want to get the trophies or do you want us to? And he said, Oh, I have a connection. I get all the trophies for my Broward archery club. And I was like, Broward has an archery club?

He said, we have the best in the state. So it doesn't matter what interest, like you were sparked by as a kid and inspired by your dad. But if there's something that someone's listening to and said, you know, I really wanted to try underwater basket weaving or, you know, clay throwing. Now's the time to do it. So when you do get to that empty nest stage, you're ready to go. have it built in. 

[00:00:52] Nina: Welcome to Dear Nina, Conversations About Friendship. Today's episode is a topic that people write to me about all the time, which is their fear of the empty nest. And it isn't just about if you have kids, I have plenty of listeners who never had kids, don't plan to have kids. It can be when you retire. It can be if you are, newly divorced or just any time you find that you are in an opportunity. And I think it can be an opportunity to make new friends, to do new things with your life, but it is daunting. 

And so today's guest sent me a pitch. I would like to read it to you because I get a lot of pitches. And this one was just an automatic yes for me because it told me exactly what the episode was going to be about why they were the right ones to do the episode. So it was a perfect match of their expertise and experience and what I was looking for, for my listeners. So this is from Donna Kassman and Dara Collins of Modern Mahjong. 

And they wrote, Dear Nina, many friends are entering the empty nest phase of their lives and some of them are really dreading it. Celebrities like Brooke Shields share on social media how they aren't ready. We think planning ahead by embracing new hobbies and friendships can help change the focus during this major life shift. We are two friends and former practicing attorneys in South Florida who met when our now 23 year olds were in Mommy and Me music classes. When they wound up at the same elementary school, we started working together on the PTA events, eventually, a few friends decided it was time to learn mahjong and we've been playing together ever since. In 2019, we created mahjong dice and began our small business on Modern Mahjong.

com. We are thrilled to have built a community, both locally and virtually. We host events, live zooms and classes. Since 2019, we have raised over 160,000 for the Alzheimer's association through events and pre orders of the national mahjong card. Our Facebook group, Mahjong Community has over 30,000 members. Players share in our group where they're looking for games near home or during vacations and they connect with other players. During the pandemic we hosted virtual tournaments and have connected players that still play together weekly. 

Donna and Dara have written a book.

[00:03:05] Nina: They have a really robust business and we talked about hobbies and friendship preparing for the empty nest, they were just a pleasure to talk to and here they are. Hi Donna and Dara. Welcome to Dear Nina.

[00:03:16] Dara: Thanks so much for having us.

[00:03:18] Nina: you guys have such an interesting story that I want you to tell yourselves. I really think will also be an inspiration to listeners in so many different levels because your business having to do with mahjong and canasta speaks to people having hobbies and other things, but also just the very fact that you started this business maybe a little later in life. This wasn't something you were doing when you were 25 years old is in itself. Inspiring. which one of you would like to tell your business slash friendship story? Really?

[00:03:48] Donna: It's interesting because Dara and I went to rival high schools when we were younger. but Dara is 7 years younger than me, so I wouldn't know her anyway. Then we went to the same law school, but again, Dara was younger than me. We didn't really meet until our firstborn kids went to preschool. So we met as parents, we did a lot of events at our children's school in PTA. We wrote a cookbook. We got donors for carnivals. We raised a lot of money for the school. So then at that point, we knew that we could work together well. So we were friends and then became business partners.

My story is a little different than Dara's. So I was a practicing attorney. First kid, it was doable. Second kid came along. My father passed away. My mother got sick and it just became too much. So I retired basically and stayed home to help take care of my mother and my children. And I started to learn mahjong. Dara can tell where it goes from there. 

[00:04:43] Dara: when I grew up in New York, my mom played mahjong all the time and I was laughing cause I thought it was for older women. And I look back and I think she was 36. So it's so funny to me how your definition of older women changes. But when I heard friends were starting, I'm like, you know, I kind of remember sitting on her lap and I remember what the tiles look like and hearing her friends laugh.

So I'm like, okay, I'll learn too. And then we were playing for probably over 10, 12 years. And Donna, it was very bittersweet, but her mom told her to buy herself something. I think it started us on the collecting of mahjong sets. So I kind of blamed Donna for that. But she bought this first beautiful bone and bamboo set.

And anyone who plays mahjong or has seen the tiles, they're works of art. And what's great about them is they're works of art you could play with. And the set that she bought came with these tiny little dice that were very plain and hard to see. But what was bizarre is it came in a wood holder, which is called a coffin. And when she was so excited showing me this beautiful set, and I saw that I just associate words with things. I was like, I'm going to go home and I'm going to find her cheery dice with mahjong symbols. And there weren't any. And you know, necessity is the mother of invention.

I was like, Donna, this is a weird ask, but I have a gift idea for you, but I think it would be fun to do together. And we designed 10 pair. My maiden name is Mosher. Our first pair we hear cha ching and it's Phyllis Mosher from Boca. So I'm like, mom, you didn't have to buy the first pair. 

[00:06:03] Nina: Oh. 

[00:06:04] Dara: a pair. And unfortunately Donna did not get one of those first pair because we sold the other nine pair within like three hours. So I, it was a gift that she didn't get, but it started our journey of beginning with a beautiful roll, and that was in 2019.

[00:06:17] Nina: So a roll is a pair of die. So, you know, it's interesting. I do play Mahjong, and I've played a long time. I also started in my thirties and I'm 47 just for context. There are still constantly things I'm learning. Like, I don't know that I ever learned properly. And so I'll sometimes play with another group or I'll even see posts that you to make, on your Facebook group. And I'll be like, wait, I never knew that. Or I didn't know that's what it was called. I wouldn't have known that. that was called a roll 

[00:06:44] Donna: When we, went to New Jersey to play with my college roommates and we don't use dice and Dara and I are like, Oh no, we keep hearing that. So we teach a lot. We teach a lot of people and we just try to teach them the rules. And then if you want to go to someone else's house and play differently, that's fine, but at least know, know the rules. But it's funny because if you would have told two attorneys that they would someday be in the dice business and then the mahjong business. Because every comes up to us. Can I work for you? I want to do what you're doing. It has to be something you're really passionate about. And it's 24 hour work, you know, we work very hard as attorneys, but having a small business is a lot of work, but you also have to have fun.

And you also, I think you have to do it with a friend because it's a lot of fun to do it with Dara. 

[00:07:24] Nina: it speaks to me that you are both attorneys. You don't have to always do the thing you did or said you wanted to do. I think people get very stuck on like, well, this is what I went to school for.

I don't have the skills to do such and such. And as we speak about this next stage of life, and I know a lot of people have new terms for the empty nest. Gretchen Rubin is working on this topic and this is what we're talking about today, because women I especially, I think, end up, pretty lonely, you know, and I deal a lot here in loneliness and new stages and new opportunities. I want people to see it as an opportunity, but I'm not quite in that stage. So tell me where the two of you are vis a vis the empty nest stage.

[00:08:03] Donna: I have a 24 year old who graduated college two years ago and he moved out of state and I have a 20 year old who's in college. So the last two years we've been a quote empty nester. at the same time we lost our dog. so it was kind of and the house was very quiet. I would say to Dara, thank God we have this business because it's not just a business.

I mean, it's social. We play every week with our friends, Dara and I travel through the business. So it's a lot more than, than a game is our famous saying. So I am an empty nester, who just got a puppy a month ago, thinking, what did I do? I am actually 60 years old. I had a different career path.

And Dara, I, Didn't get married till I was 34. So I had babies at 36 and 40. I am older, but very confident in terms of our business and what I can do. I am an empty nester, but we do have this business, which keeps us very busy and I've made a lot of friends through it. The house was very quiet for the last two years. So that's why we got a puppy.

[00:09:00] Dara: what amazes me is most people say, when I become an empty nester, come back to me and teach me mahjong or teach me canasta. And we're like, no, no, no. You need to invest in yourself now because you hear people all the time. How much money do I need to retire? How much money do I need to be an empty nester and travel?

But if you already have a social game in place, whether it's mahjong, canasta bridge, whether it's needlepoint, whatever your hobby is, it is such a way to build community we started. I remember we jumped up and down when we had 300 people in our Facebook group.

And now I think we have 37, 000 active people that come together to talk about this game. It's a discussion group and you get people angry and you get people, but very civil and educated discourse on the game. And they'll put in, Hey, I'm traveling to Texas. Where can I play? And people go, Oh, come to my house or meet us at the library. And I joke that I have more friends or I have a better social life when I visit LA than I do here. I have more games when I travel and it's all because of mahjong. 

[00:09:57] Donna: We just tell women, don't wait, start preparing for the empty nester. Play tennis, pickleball, whatever it is you want to do. Don't wait until the chickies leave the nest. And then you're sitting there going, what am I going to do? And the other issue, what we found is all our friends were our children's friends, you know, friends, moms. Okay. And all of a sudden that goes away. You know, they graduate high school and you're sitting there going, where's all my friends that I used to hang out with? That's tough.

[00:10:22] Nina: through sports? Donna, so when you say the friends went away, was it kind of a sports based connection?

[00:10:29] Donna: sports based. It was debate. I used to travel with the debate team and be a judge for all these tournaments. So I would travel, hang out with the other parents. so there was a lot of different things, but when your kids graduate high school and go off to college, all the other parents are busy or they're empty nesters and we're going to travel, you know, we're not going to stay home and hang out. So you lose that whole core base of quote friends that you've had for so many years.

[00:10:53] Nina: I think the hobby is so important to you for all the reasons you're saying. I personally have a lot of friends that aren't connected to my kids per se. What I'm thinking about for the future is, when people start moving. I live in Minnesota and it is not uncommon as people get older to spend six months somewhere warmer. They come to you, they come to you in Florida or they go to Arizona or they go to California. jokingly among my friends, we kind of talk about, Oh, where might you go? Where might you go? And, it is clear that there's going to be dispersing, not for the whole year, but it is tough to live somewhere so cold when you're in your seventies, your eighties, I mean, it's nice to be able to walk outside and not worry about the ice and stuff. And I think about if you have a hobby. A game is a great one because you can do it no matter your health.

My dad had Parkinson's and he was really in bad shape. He had it for about 20 years. He was diagnosed when he was 58, but from 70 to 80, he died at 80. He had bridge. Thank God he had bridge. My parents had a long standing bridge game from the time they were married in their twenties. It was huge. my mom was not a mahjong person or canasta. She still plays bridge. if he had not had bridge, I mean, he had to give up running. Eventually he had to give up tennis. He was a huge tennis player, but that bridge, saved him for some time was like all he could really do socially and people would come over and play with him. And it's grateful for that.

[00:12:09] Donna: Yeah, because where you live in south Florida, we see that we see the retirees come down and they play any types of card games rummikub and mahjong is one of them and that is their social life But I just want to say something Dara and I always say when you're a mom with young kids And say you have a Monday mahjong game. You normally wouldn't say, I'm going to Dara's house to hang out for three, four hours. You'd feel guilty. I'm a mom. I have to be home. I have to do this. But when you have a set game every week, I'm going to go to her house for four hours and my kids will be fine. So it kind of forces you to take time for yourself.

[00:12:41] Dara: we really saw what you're saying about the how bridge was so important to your dad during COVID during the pandemic. We were only in business for less than a year. It was like nine months and we're like, well, that was fun. And then we saw how people were like, what do I do with my week? I'm stuck at home.

So that's when I started playing canasta online with my husband. We'd sit across the table and play. But what Donna and I started doing is we started hosting Zooms and our first one, 24 people came and we were like, 24 people wanted to hear what we had to say. And then I think our last one, we had like 2, 500 people come. It connected people and we called it our Brady Bunch screen because people who never met in person, we had people joining us in their bed at nine, you know, like midnight from London and people from the East coast and West coast. And they were like, Oh, hi, hi, Tony, how are you? And it was such a nice way to connect people.

And then the other thing we did is we started having virtual tournaments and we donated each month to a charity. People said that the tournaments and the Wednesday zooms were the one day. I mean, if my husband saw that my hair was straight, he knew, Oh, you're going to be on camera tonight. Aren't you?

Like I didn't have a ponytail and sweatpants. Well, I still have sweatpants, but at least you couldn't see him off camera. So it really showed us, I mean, there's studies that show that loneliness is as bad as smoking like a pack of cigarettes. And we hear all the time about the evils of social media.

And, you know, that could be a whole other episode of a podcast, but the power of social media to get people with like minds and interests is amazing because people realize, wow, I'm not the only one that loves to have 80 sets of mahjong tiles, and I'm not the only one that loves to play four days a week. So it really bonds people.

[00:14:14] Nina: And it's an in, so that's what I was saying. Like, I always think for myself, like I took up tennis, about four years ago maybe somewhat in honor of my dad who would have loved to have kept playing I was like, I'm not getting any younger. I used to play when I was a kid. Then I kept thinking I'll wait.

I waited all through my thirties. And exactly what you, you guys are saying, I was like, Oh, it's just not the right time. I'm too busy. And I have four kids . And I was like, I don't need a sport. Like that's their thing. And then, some of my friends were starting to play not necessarily together even they were all different levels, but I would be on the phone with someone and she'd be like, Oh, I have to go. I'm going to play tennis. And I would feel a little jealous. Eventually with some self awareness, I was like, wait, I don't have to be jealous. I can go to the tennis store. I have a car, like I'm an independent person. If I want to play tennis, I can play tennis. I just have to do it. Sometimes these going from zero to one is, you know, it feels insurmountable, just taking that first step, but now it is the true joy of my life.

And I know eventually pickle will be in my future. I just feel like I have to play out the tennis thing while I still can manage the whole court. but I also think of it as sort of a little social insurance policy, mahjong and tennis. I'm like, okay, one day when my husband and I move somewhere else for part of the season, that's an in, you need an in.

 And that's what we're talking about, joining a game or starting a game of your own, whether it's a card game or more an athletic kind of thing, or even like a walk. I know people who, you know, they're always scheduling a walk with someone new. It doesn't have to be a hobby that requires a whole new skill set. Just this idea of having something that you plan and that you do and that you're known for. You know people who are like, oh, they walk every day with someone.That's their thing. And that's an in. 

[00:15:51] Donna: Yeah. I mean, I, for example, I had dinner last night with a friend of mine who grew up in California and raised her kids. And eventually they moved back to South Florida because all their parents were elderly in Florida. So she said to me, when I moved here, I'm lonely. She said, all of you have grown up, your kids have all grown up together, but I'm lonely.

So I introduced her to these people to play Mahjong. Dara taught her how to play Canasta and she plays pickleball three hours every single day. And last night she said, these are my people. They go to theater together. They'll go to dinner together. These people she met through pickleball she's busier than I am now.

I said, you haven't lived here in 50 years and here she is busy, busy. It's all different connections with all different things. And she's happy again. Cause at first she was lonely when she moved back.

[00:16:35] Dara: And Nina, I love that you did tennis in honor of your dad. It doesn't have to be any of the hobbies we're talking about. To a throwback to when Donna and I first met because of our kids, we set up a chess and scrabble group for the kids. I did not know anything more than how the chess pieces worked, but they were in second grade and they knew chess.

So all we had to do was supply the sets and host the meeting. And we were having a tournament with another school. And I said to the gentleman, do you want to get the trophies or do you want us to? And he said, Oh, I have a connection. I get all the trophies for my Broward archery club. And I was like, Broward has an archery club.

He said, we have the best in the state. So it doesn't matter what interest, like you were sparked by as a kid and inspired by your dad. But if there's something that someone's listening to and said, you know, I really wanted to try underwater basket weaving or, you know, clay throwing, now's the time to do it.

So when you do get to that empty nest stage, you're not hitting the ground empty, you're ready to go, you have it built in.

[00:17:27] Nina: See the two of you, it's like your own, informal research study because you are in contact online and in person with so many people. just it seems like this idea that it's not too late, It's like really never too late, but the earlier you can start, maybe the better.

[00:17:40] Donna: My advice is just don't focus solely on your kids. I know it's very hard. I worked part time from home as an attorney, even with the kids, to keep my brain going, but just don't focus solely on the kids needs, because they will leave the nest, and yeah, as you say, you're just sitting there going, Okay, what are we doing? So that's a big piece of advice. 

[00:17:58] Nina: even people without kids. If focus completely on, work or your partner, if you have a partner, still, you're going to retire eventually, still, you're going to find yourself with more time on your hands. And that loneliness thing is, is no joke. It's huge, huge health hazard.

[00:18:14] Donna: we had a mahjong event at a restaurant in Aventura, Florida. We had 28 people. one of the people came up to me and said, this is so nice. Some of these women are just, they're widows and they're single and they're living here and they were so happy to come. So it doesn't have to be just empty nesters.

There are a lot of widows. That don't are lonely and don't have friends and it was wonderful to bring everybody together and we're going to continue to do those because it was, it was great.

[00:18:38] Dara: and they could sign up in a group where they could sign up for themselves and then we have them rotate tables and I saw people taking out their phone and exchanging numbers and that just makes us so happy. When we were doing our tournaments, we try to get people on the same time zone so they could sign on and play together.

There's people that message us and they send us pictures. They've been playing since 2020 together. And then they'll finally travel to each other's house and take pictures. there's people that travel the country in RVs and post in our group, Hey, I'm going to be in Duluth. You know, where can I play?

The welcoming nature of mahjong and canasta players and in any other, I mean, I see similar groups for pickleball, you know, there's where I'm going to be here, where can I play? It's just such a great way to prepare yourself for combating loneliness.

[00:19:21] Nina: It really makes me emotional. You're out there giving them a skill, connecting them and, the vibe of you can do this, it's kind of, cause we kind of have two messages here, which is you should start young.

And I really believe that even just not necessarily a game, you should start young with the idea like Donna said, to make time for yourself, make time for friends. I mean, that's a huge message of mine always you have to make time for your social life and you have to sort of feed these friendships.

You can't let years and years go by. I just did an episode about long distance friends and how you don't need as much time as you think, like you need time, but you don't need it to be a week long retreat every year. You don't need to go away every year. It may be that you're in town for work or some other reason and you just make sure you get a walk in.

Or you at least talk on the phone throughout the year. everything doesn't have to be like a whole big thing, but it does need attention. And I feel this way about hobbies that said sort of a dual message, which seems opposite, but they're both important is it's never too late. Even if you didn't do it when you were in your twenties, your thirties, your forties, your fifties, even if you're in your sixties, seventies, eighties, it is not too late to take up something that will connect you to other people.

[00:20:29] Donna: my mother did not play mahjong. She thought the tiles were too loud. I mean, she was a card game person. So I learned it. I think I was about 45 when I started playing. part of it, I want to say too, is any of this gameplay, any of the stuff is good for brain health. So Dara and I raise a lot of money for Alzheimer's association.

Mahjong and Alzheimer's just go together because every year there's a new card and you have to relearn the card but brain health is really important because there is something called menopause brain, there's baby brain, there's menopause brain, and as you get older, you really have to keep developing those skills, whether it's crossword puzzles, or any of these things we're talking about is good for your brain health.

[00:21:05] Dara: And there's a joke one of the women in our group said, said her mother played well into her 80s and we're like, did she play well into her 80s or did she play really well? And she was saying that her mother didn't have Facebook. The way they would connect is they'd go to the laundromat and put their phone number and say, if you play Mahjong, come call me. And what you were saying, that we're connecting people and everything. But when we get emails from people that we taught, My husband and I missed, you know, we did a virtual class. We missed lesson four, but we watched it online and we can't stop playing.

We're playing online. We're going to look for another group to play in person. It just makes us so happy. I'm like, we did that. We gave people a hobby. So I just love that, you know, to us, that's such a rewarding part of our day.

[00:21:43] Donna: and Dara has a good point. I mean, when you're an empty nester, sometimes you look at your husband and you're like, okay, I mean, you know, what are we doing? And during COVID, a lot of men were forced to learn how to play Siamese Mahjong, which is two people, because there's only the two of them, canasta. And it's really, brought couples together a lot, or they can go to a summer home in North Carolina and play with two other couples. And it's something to bring couples together too.

[00:22:08] Dara: Yeah. My husband jokes. We're going to get an RV and hit the road and go find canasta tournaments all around when we retire.

[00:22:14] Nina: That's funny. Mahjong saved a rainy day at my in laws cabin recently. My mother in law plays, my sister in law plays, I play, but we have another sister in law, well, they're sisters, the two of them, and she had never learned to play. Her name's Jaci. Shout out to Jaci. I just bought her her first card and I was like, Jaci, this is it.

You are finally learning to play and now she can play. It's like. Now we have four of us and I know you can play three. I've never learned how to play two. I do know how to play three. I have to ask you guys a Mahjong question. Is it my imagination or is this year's card way better than last year's? I hated that 2023 card. When we finally got the new one, I was like, that card is dead to me. I'm never playing 2023. Do other people feel that way?

[00:22:53] Dara: So 2023, my term for it was that it was consistently inconsistent. Cause normally when you learn the card, the patterns in certain sections repeat. So if it's like a bell curve in the 9, it's also the same way. And, and where last year it was like up and down here, and then this was single and that was it.

It was a split. It was a love, hate relationship. So this year, I think a lot of people like it a lot more. 

[00:23:17] Nina: good. So it's not, it's

[00:23:19] Donna: No, I think everybody we've spoken to, including my college roommates all love this year's card. Much

[00:23:24] Nina: It's a good card. Now, what other funny little mahj thing that I learned from somebody else on Instagram. I didn't know that for news you couldn't

[00:23:33] Donna: use a joker

[00:23:34] Nina: But could you pull for it?

I can't remember. Can you call for?

[00:23:38] Dara: win when that's your 14th tile. You can't expose it before you win.

[00:23:42] Nina: Yes. So that I learned well into this card, like I, and that's, I mean, there's been other news and other cards and we've definitely been playing that wrong.

[00:23:50] Dara: our numbers

[00:23:51] Nina: I don't know how that 

[00:23:51] Dara: you could always ask us any Mahjong question. Well,

[00:23:56] Donna: we also do refresher courses. We just did a four series class on Zoom and people are always asking refresher, like, I played 30 years ago, but I don't remember. And we do refreshers, and we do strategy sessions, you know, 'cause maybe you did play when you're in your thirties and now you're 70 and you don't remember. So. That's also, it's just great for the brains. It will work and think about all these different things.

[00:24:16] Nina: I can feel my brain working when I play and I like that it forces, um, like you said, it could be four hours, three hours. You do have some chit chat, but it's not just chit chat. Like you have something else to do with your hands, with your head, with your, you know, you're busy. You're setting up it's a different way of being with your friends, which is Really important. Um, as we wind up here, is there any last thing you wanted to say that we haven't covered?

[00:24:40] Dara: just like you were saying to wrap up the flow of the game, and whether it's bridge or Canasta or Mahjong. While you're playing, you're serious and you're using your brain and you're focusing. But while you're setting up the tiles, you're mixing them and that's when you're chatting. And that's when I'm saying to Donna, Oh, you know what?

I need a new groomer for my dog. Did you find a good one? And Oh, how's, how's your mom doing? How's your dad? You know, it's such a great way to build connections and become lifelong friends. And then the other hand, it's just a way to meet new people like at the events that we had. I mean, so many people exchange numbers and connected. So there's just so many layers of how helpful it was. Any kind of hobby could be.

[00:25:15] Donna: I just want to say that for me, you know, at a certain time in your life, you've worked hard, you've made money. You get to a point in your life where you're thinking about giving back to people and charity. Through Mahjong, we've raised, over 100, 000 for Alzheimer's Association.

Mahjong and charity go really well together. People play games and save the money and at the end of the year, donate to a charity. I think as you get older in life, you think more about giving back to others and it could be your pickleball group raises money for some organization, your bridge club, whatever it is, mahjong.

So I just think for me, as I get older, that's an important aspect of my life. Like what else is there? I want to give back and help others.

[00:25:54] Nina: That's beautiful. I'm glad you brought that up. Donna and Dara of Modern Mahjong thank you so much for being here. I'm going to have all the ways that listeners can find the business, the Facebook group, just everything about you in my show notes. I Love what you're doing. So thank you so much.

[00:26:10] Dara: We love what 

[00:26:10] Donna: Thank you for having us.

[00:26:12] Nina: Listeners, before you go, I am popping back on here to say that since recording this episode, I have brought up in the Facebook group that I was going to be talking about hobbies. You find that by going to dear Nina, the group. That really is the full name, Dear Nina The Group, and that's on Facebook, different than page for the podcast.

I know that's confusing. There's groups and there's pages. But I'm talking about The Group, which is a private group, and people put friendship issues on there. They write them anonymously sometimes or with their name. We talk about stuff, we talk about friendship stuff, we talk about the books we're reading, the TV shows we're watching, the recipes we're cooking.

In this particular conversation, we were talking about hobbies people are engaged in that involve other people. Because there are passions you can have and hobbies you can have that are solitary activities. And that's great too. That's great for expanding your mind and just enjoying yourself and relaxing.

What I wanted people to put in this conversation was what are activities they do with other people. there were several other tennis players, paddle, pickleball, things like nonprofit board positions. And that's a great idea because it's can be an idea or a cause you're passionate about, but then you're with other people working on those things.

I'm just reading these now. Biking, stand up comedy classes, Zumba, book clubs, of course, scrapbooking, movie clubs, walking groups, several people said volunteering, which I thought was great, crafting, some sort of learning, I put Jewish learning, other kinds of religious activities, yoga classes, and I know there'll be more as the days go on. So feel free to join the group and check in on that or if you're in the group and you haven't been there in a while come see what you've been missing. Hope to see you there and you can always find me on lots of social media more than I should but I do enjoy it Instagram and TikTok at dearninafriendship.

Alright, we'll see you back next week. Bye